Mini-Ep 431: For A Good Job Call…
Doree and Elise answer listener questions about Elise’s new TED Talk and discuss Doree’s new advice column with Slate. And they share a special voice note from Elise’s daughter to answer a listener question about tween style!
Mentioned in this Episode
Get 50% off your first hair care subscription order
Doree’s new column! Slate’s Good Job
Trader Joe’s Elevated Mixed Nuts
Trader Joe’s Everything But The Bagel Bag of Cashews and Almonds
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Transcript
This episode transcript is AI generated.
Doree (00:10):
Hello and welcome to Forever 35, a podcast about the things we do to take care of ourselves. I'm Doree Shafrir.
Elise (00:16):
And I'm Elise Hu. And we're just two friends who like to talk a lot about serums,
Doree (00:21):
And this is a mini episode where we hear from you, we share your comments and your thoughts, and we answer your questions to the best of our ability. Please remember, we are not experts. We're podcast hosts and we always encourage you to seek support first and foremost, from a medical and or mental health professional as needed.
Elise (00:38):
I wonder how busy mental health professionals are these days, and
Doree (00:42):
Then, oh boy.
Elise (00:43):
Mental health professionals also need support, so mental health professionals are seeing their mental health professionals. I was just
Doree (00:50):
Thinking about
Elise (00:50):
That, but I just hope everybody is resourced up. We need to get resourced up.
Doree (00:54):
Oh man. I know. I always think about Tony Soprano's, therapist. Therapist.
Elise (01:07):
What if you were just a therapist to therapists? Your job was your clientele was only other therapists.
Doree (01:14):
I feel like that must exist, but then it's also like where does it end? Who is the ultimate therapist or is it just circular? The top therapist ends up going back to the first therapist. You know what I mean? John, the
Elise (01:31):
Right it ends at, yeah, it's parallel lines never meet. John goes,
Doree (01:36):
Yeah, John goes to Susan, Susan goes to Tom, Tom goes to Jessica, Jessica goes to Paul, and Paul goes back to John.
Elise (01:45):
It's like a very complicated math problem or just a very simple circle.
Doree (01:52):
I feel like every therapist must have a therapist. If you're a therapist, for sure, let us know You believed in it. Do you have a therapist? How do you find a therapist? What do you think about therapy for yourself and for mental health professionals? I'm very curious actually.
Elise (02:08):
Yeah, yeah. I need to ask my therapist next time, how did you decide on who your match was? But I assume it's the same way as we all decide, is this a fit? Does this person sort of see me and get me and challenge me in the right ways or challenge me in the ways that I want to be challenged in my introspection and self understanding and all of that. So yeah, call in. I know we have some therapists in our listenership, so let us know how you're doing because it's a ver y psychologically unsafe time for this country. It feels,
Doree (02:46):
Oh my Gosh
Elise (02:47):
And how you decide who your therapist is or going to be on a totally separate request since this is our mini app and a lot of folks call in with advice for us when we have questions too. The other question that I want to throw out there is my scalp is very itchy. I'm guessing because it's dry. It just started happening over the last couple of days, and y'all have really good wrecks for that. I've also noticed I have hair falling out. I'm really shedding in the shower, but I think that might have to do with just the last couple of weeks. It started a week after the fires, so I think it's pretty acute, but also I'm sort of itchy at the base nape of my neck. So any advice y'all have there is welcome.
Doree (03:43):
Have you tried using an anti dandruff shampoo?
Elise (03:46):
Yeah, yeah. No, I don't know if it's dandruff because I'm not flaky or anything, but I could just have dry scalp. So I've tried a traditional one from Neutrogena or something.
Doree (04:00):
I learned on TikTok that using an anti dandruff shampoo, even if you don't have dandruff a couple times a week, is supposed to help with hair growth.
Elise (04:13):
oh!
Doree (04:14):
Yeah, I've been using niel NI don't know how you say it. I try to use it a couple of times a week and I don't know, I'm also doing a whole bunch of other things to help with hair growth right now, so it's hard to say is that the thing? But I don't know. Might be something to try. Okay,
Elise (04:35):
And then SVE makes one I think that people have recommended.
Doree (04:38):
Yeah, you want to make sure that it has ketoconazole in it.
Elise (04:44):
Okay.
Doree (04:44):
Alright. And I think not all of them do, so
Elise (04:52):
Just I'll check my ingredients.
Doree (04:55):
Yeah, check your ingredients. You can also go back to our sponsor pros and tweak your formula
Elise (05:02):
Oh that's right!
Doree (05:02):
That you have dry scalp or irritation and they will send you a new formula. I need to go back there. That will help with that.
Elise (05:13):
Yeah. Okay. That's a great idea because I loved my pros. I loved my pros last summer. It made my hair feel great, but obviously I have different needs now. So it's time to update it.
Doree (05:27):
Elise, we got two separate texts asking for you to talk about your TED Talk. One person said, tell us about the TED talk that Elise did, and then someone else said, Elise, congratulations on your excellent TED talk. I'd love to hear about what the process of preparing and delivering a TED Talk was like.
Elise (05:46):
Yeah, so my TED Talk just came out on YouTube I think last week, and then it came out on ted.com the week before. It was sometime at the beginning of February or very end of January, and I gave it last October, end of October in Atlanta at the new TED main stage, which is called TED Next, and it was extremely nerve wracking. It's about a big idea that I've been talking about a lot over the last couple of years and is in my book and it's about the way that our beauty standards are now getting influenced or set by what we see in our feeds and what the algorithm shows us and what filters are showing us as what matters. And so as filters go for more arched eyebrows, then we also want more arched eyebrows as filters automatically put a little highlighter at the tip of your nose. Then we are also actually putting a highlighter at the tip of our noses, and you see it a lot in celebrity culture, but where's the end point to this? Because ai, we're going to look more and more Cy Borgian over time,
(06:51):
And in some ways you're kind of seeing that bear out among some celebrities who can afford to spend a lot of time on their appearance. And so the talk is about that. It was born out of an idea that I had been reporting on and writing about and really fleshed out in the technological gaze chapter of my book, and I prepared for it first by just trying to outline the major idea that I wanted to talk about. I think the TED curators are pretty rigorous about what is your idea, what is the provocative idea? What is the idea that other people could kind of spread pretty easily or how would they talk about it if after you gave a talk about it, so you really kind of hone the idea and then break out the structure of it. And then I just kind of did a pass. I did a first pass to make sure I hit all the major points that I wanted to in the outline. I had a really good curator. So Ted, if you're giving a TED Talk, they assign you a curator who really works with you rigorously over not just the talk itself and that material, but also the delivery of it. You have to give rehearsals on Zoom and then in person
(08:12):
Over the course of a couple months so that they can battle test your idea. And then there's a pretty rigorous legal and fact checking process. Every slide needs to go through a legal clearance. There's a lot of stuff. So the process is long delivering. It was really anxiety provoking. I think we talked at the time or on the show in the fall after I'd gotten back that I was picking fights with Rob every day. He had come with me to Atlanta at the talk, and I was just very uncertain about how it was going to go because it feels fine when you're rehearsing it a million times, but I was really nervous about the high wire act, and I don't actually like to speak in front of crowds despite being a very extroverted person and speaking in front of mics. So just getting over that was really hard, but I did it and I felt great after.
(09:08):
That was one of my favorite days of 2024. All of us in the same TED session getting together for dinner after we had gotten to give our TED talks and our plus ones came along and we were all able to thank them for coming to our TED talk, which is now a cliche, but it was funny to literally be able to say that. And so yeah. Thanks y'all for checking it out. It's on ted.com and it's on YouTube. If you Google just Elise Hugh Ted Talk, and I'd love for you to watch it if you haven't and to hear y'all's feedback too.
Doree (09:41):
Love that. What a cool, cool thing.
Elise (09:44):
Yeah,
Doree (09:46):
Yeah. Thanks for taking us behind the scenes.
Elise (09:50):
That's what this show is for. That's what y'all get. That's what
Doree (09:51):
The show's for. Please call or text us at (781) 591-0390. Email us at Forever 35 podcast@gmail.com. We're still taking your questions about friendship and everything else, so send those on over. Our website is forever 35 podcast com. We're on Instagram at FE 35 podcast. You can sign up for our newsletter at February 35 podcast.com/newsletter and shop our favorite products at shop my us slash forever five. We're going to take a short break and we'll be right. We all right? We are back with a question that I just love. Alright, I will read it. Hi there. I have a sort of random question. Where do you shop for cool tween clothes? My daughter is 10 and a half and starting to take a strong interest in her wardrobe. I love this for her and want to nurture her, but I'm not sure where to shop with her for clothes that are cool, but still age appropriate. Elise, your daughter is obviously quite cool, so I thought you might have a little insight in this area also, I know this is a small thing in light of everything, but I'm trying to stay sane by leaning into the things I can control that and calling my senators a ton. Thank you both for this pod. It's a consistent bright spot.
Elise (11:19):
Oh, that is very sweet. And
Doree (11:22):
That's
Elise (11:22):
Really sweet. We talked about this last week, but keep up the calls, sustaining calls to your lawmakers about whatever issue you care about. A lot matters. Yes. We talked about how the right wing continuously calls on every matter, and that skews reality for lawmakers because they're judging the pulse of America by these calls. So you can influence that. You can influence their unscientific surveys by calling a lot and calling consistently.
Doree (11:52):
Yeah, I think it's important to call wherever you are, but especially if you are in Republican controlled states.
Elise (12:00):
Yes,
Doree (12:00):
Yes, please, please keep calling. But also in places that have democratic representation, we need to be telling those representatives to also speak up and keep fighting.
Elise (12:14):
Totally. And they use it to take a pulse on what matters to people. So there's the assumption that we all care a lot about the price of eggs and not about Ukrainians for example, or Gazen or whoever, but if you do call about the issues that matter to you, then that's an opportunity to just help create that or help paint a clearer picture of the mosaic of interests that exist in that district or in that state that you live in.
Doree (12:43):
Yes. And now back to the question at hand.
Elise (12:49):
Yes,
Doree (12:49):
Yes. Elisa's oldest daughter, Ava was kind enough to record a voice memo for us.
Elise (12:58):
Yeah. Because we couldn't answer the question. Yeah. I was like,
Doree (13:03):
I dunno, I'm not cool. No, but Ava is very cool. So here we go. I'm going to play this.
Listener Voicemail (13:13):
Hi, it's Ava. Thank you for the compliment. And it's so cool that your daughter is starting to get interested in fashion. I think that when I was her age, I really liked Hollister, which is a really good brand, especially for people who are maybe smaller because Hollister has extra, extra small and extra small adult so you can get small sizes. That's what I did when I was her age. And I also really like target clothes, target starting to get a lot of style and teen fashion style. I also like h and MI like h and m because they also have extra small and extra small and small. Old Navy has really good jeans. Old Navy has also really soft and cute sweaters and jeans. Jeans are jeans are great for Hollister. Hollister. I've seen people with short legs or long legs can wear Hollister jeans. Hollister has a really wide range. I feel like Hollister would be the best or Target shirts, old Navy sweaters or basic t-shirt, the basics. Old Navy has all the basics if you want some basics and yeah, thank you.
Elise (14:24):
There's so much in there. It's so funny because she's like, when I was her age 18 months ago,
Doree (14:30):
Right? She's 12, so it's not
Elise (14:33):
Like David's 12, your daughter is 10 and a half. But yeah, so she shops, it sounds like she shops at adult places, but in their smallest sizes because she couldn't fit into a lot of the adult clothes when she was 10 and a half.
Doree (14:48):
I love all these recommendations
Elise (14:51):
And also that Target is cool now. I remember being ashamed when I was little, if I got close at Target because it seemed, I guess not cool, but what great marketing and branding work Target has done. Or maybe they've changed their, obviously they've changed a lot of their vendors and suppliers and so now Target is cools.
Doree (15:12):
Well, I think they also just decided to rip off other brands like Universal Thread is a Madewell knockoff, you know what I mean? They just were like, we're going to just do this. And honestly it seems to be working for them.
Elise (15:36):
It does seem to be working.
Doree (15:39):
Yeah, it's so interesting. Henry, he definitely has preferences and we've taken him shopping once. We actually took him shopping at Target and he did pick some stuff out that he wanted. Mostly Halloween themed things that he wears year round. But yeah, he's not really at the age where he has super strong opinions about it. Maybe it is also like a girl boy thing. I don't know.
Elise (16:10):
Yeah, my younger daughters are not as particular about their clothing as my oldest. My oldest is just, she's a Virgo. I always say this, I mean it's not just because of her star sign, but she's just always been very intentional and deliberate and specific about what she likes, what she doesn't like. And Luna doesn't care. Luna will wear pajamas to school. She often does. She just doesn't have that same aesthetic sense or interest. And then Issa now that she's nine, she is more into it, but I almost think it's an influence from her sister. And I don't know if it wasn't for having to live in the same house as a tween, whether my middle daughter would be as interested in certain cuts of jeans or whatnot. I do think Ava has too many clothes. I don't buy clothes for her because I think she has, she's too many pairs of jeans, for example, and just doesn't need it all. But her dad does because she's often shopping on the weekends with Maddie and they're usually with Maddie on the weekend evenings. So they do a lot of shopping and then also she gets a small allowance. She gets like $12 a week. She gets her age in allowance
Doree (17:27):
Per week. Oh, that's cool.
Elise (17:29):
And so she just saves up her money. She buys on Depop sometimes. She also sells on Depop because all the kids, that's a great resell site for kids. So Depop is another recommendation I guess from us adults. That's a good place to look because the harm of fashion has already been done there and you're recycling rather than, I have a lot of concerns about fast fashion. And so I don't love the idea that she likes h and m. I do buy nothing months as much as possible. And so I really encourage, especially for clothing that is not going to be trendy a year from now.
Doree (18:10):
Just get
Elise (18:10):
It on Depop, get it on.
Doree (18:13):
Yeah, I think that's a pretty good rule of thumb generally is check a resale site first. The thing with resale sites is you kind of need to know what you're looking for. There's not as much browsing as there would be at a non secondhand,
Elise (18:33):
Yeah.
Doree (18:33):
Secondhand store. Is that what?
Elise (18:37):
You know what I mean? But with the tweens, they're often following trends. So you can look for that specific flag sweater or that specific numbered t-shirt,
(18:47):
The one with 87 on it or whatever. So I actually think for tweens is the great age group. If you're trying to follow the trend of what your friends are wearing or what you're seeing out there, then you can look for it specifically. So there's that.
Doree (19:03):
Yeah, for sure. Well, so cool that you got Ava to respond. Thank you Ava. Yeah, thanks Ava for your insights and listener. I hope this is helpful for your daughter. Alright, we are going to take another short break and we we'll be right back. We'll be right back. Alright, we're back and we have another voicemail. Hey
Listener Voicemail (19:36):
Guys, I have a question about work. Just a little background. I work for a nonprofit and ever since last week when two weeks ago, the threat about federal funding possibly coming to it has changed the environment and it got everyone a little on edge. And I have felt since that time that my boss has been really switched up and has been micromanaging me. My question is how do I approach this conversation? I feel like accusing her of being micromanaging isn't probably going to go well, but I also want to be sensitive to the issue at hand. And I understand they probably need to get into the nuances of everyone's role if they're concerned about making cuts. My supervisor before her in the same company was very much a millennial manager and just let us do our job and praise us where she could. I'm having a hard time adjusting. I'll take any advice that you've got. Thanks so much for all you do. Talk to you later. Bye.
Elise (20:51):
That's really tough. I'm hearing about that all over the place. And even major foundations who have DEIJ programs because who could argue with equity and inclusion, they're trying to rename it and just call it something else so that you don't become the target for either culture wars or defunding or whatever. And so everybody's trying to be careful and while maintaining their programs ideally. So just observing what your boss must be going through. I think I'm empathetic to it, but I can see how the management style does have an effect on you. So I just want to acknowledge it's difficult all around and it must be very frustrating for you as somebody who has to report to somebody in power who is stressed out clearly. Dora, what would your advice be in terms of how to handle?
Doree (21:48):
So I think in this situation, you want to sort of along the lines of what you were saying, Elise, I would really lead with empathy and kind of acknowledge that this is a really difficult time and I would sort of frame it as how can I help you?
(22:07):
Maybe we can come up with a plan together of how to approach this new world. I wouldn't lead with feeling like you're being micromanaged because I think most managers don't love that feedback, even if it's true. And especially now that she's in a very high stress situation. I also didn't totally get from your voicemail whether it feels like a switch has been flipped ever since the new administration or if she was always sort of micromanaging because you said that your old manager was a millennial and let you sort of do what you wanted. So it sounded like this has maybe been going on for a little longer, so I wasn't totally clear on that. But I think you need to have a conversation with her and maybe discuss what is realistic for her to check in on and maybe set up some sort of guardrails there
Elise (23:12):
In any relationship. Yeah. Well, in any relationship, because we're all different idiosyncratic, unique human beings, what we emotionally need may not be what the other person can emotionally deliver. And I understand it. And that's kind of like a core dynamic of human relations. And so whether it's your boss or somebody else, what I've been trying to do in my one-to-one relationships, if something needs to change is to be very specific about the request.
(23:42):
Just Like, hey, my core need might be that I need somebody off my back more. So my core need might be independence. And so flowing from that need, what is my request? My request is maybe check in on me. We need to do fewer. I'd like to be checked in on only on Mondays, or I will write to you on Slack to check in instead of having to have lots of face-to-face zooms or face-to-face meetings. So anyway, if you can get to specific requests and maybe the need at the heart of it and articulate those, that's one step. I mean, who knows, because I don't know the specific boss, but specific requests always help because then they know this is a clear, tangible thing that you're asking for.
Doree (24:31):
I like that. I also just want to plug that I have a new column in Slate called Good Job, where I am responding to workplace advice questions. So if you have any questions, you can send those over. Send them to Slate.
Elise (24:53):
Yeah,
Doree (24:53):
Well we will link to the column in our show notes and there's also a link in the column to, they want a form. So there's a form to submit for questions.
Elise (25:07):
Yay. And congrat questions. Taking this door on her new role as a workplace advice columnist. Are you excited about this? Thank you.
Doree (25:15):
Yeah, ask.
Elise (25:17):
It's cool. They have dear prudence there. This is like a whole new thing.
Doree (25:21):
Yeah, they have prudence because prudence can be
Elise (25:22):
Kind of wild.
Doree (25:23):
They have Dear Prudence, they have a parenting advice column, they have a sex advice column. So I think they're just trying to sort of expand their advice column purview. And it's me and another great journalist named Laura Helmuth, and we're switching off. So I think it's running twice a week and mine are coming out on Thursdays and hers are coming out on Tuesdays.
Elise (25:51):
Awesome.
Doree (25:52):
So check that out. And we are just going to end with a Trader Joe's recommendation. A listener named Jen wrote in to say, I highly recommend the Trader Joe's elevated mixed nuts. I got hooked a couple of weeks ago and my husband and I finish sounds so good. One can in day or two, I think we buy at least two of these cans per week. I would honestly buy more. It's 5 99 for one. Can I just want to note that I think this elevated thing is a new branding for them because I bought their elevated crackers for cheese and crackers, and they were really good. People were like, whoa, where are these crackers from? And they were definitely more expensive than the typical Trader Joe's crackers. So I'm curious if they're doing this. They're trying to have a premium brand within their brand.
Elise (26:52):
Well, while we're on the subject of Yes, so the elevated line I have to try. And then while we're on the subject of Trader Joe's nut mixes, you all know that I ride hard for the everything but the bagel cashews and almonds, and that's not in a can. It's in a bag. So I see your elevated nut mix
Doree (27:12):
And
Elise (27:12):
I raise you the everything but the bagel bag of cashews
Doree (27:17):
And almonds. Yes, yes. Love this, love this wreck. All right, well thanks everyone for listening. Elise, thank you as always and we will talk to you all soon.
Elise (27:32):
Okay, until next time.
Doree (27:34):
Bye.