Mini-Ep 474: The Big Questions
Doree shares how her trip to Mexico went and Elise prepares to go to New York with her family. Then, they hear from listeners about the philosophical question of having children and advice on how to co-parent as a newly divorced parent.
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Transcript
This episode transcript is AI generated.
Doree Shafrir (00:10):
Hello and welcome to Forever35, a podcast about the things we do to take care of ourselves. I'm Doree Shafrir.
Elise Hu (00:17):
And I'm Elise Hu, and we're just two friends who like to talk a lot about serums and we're back for 2026, our first mini episode of 2026. Yay.
Doree Shafrir (00:26):
Yay. And as Elise alluded to, this is a mini episode where we hear from you, we share your comments and your thoughts and we answer your questions to the best of our ability. But just a reminder, we are podcast hosts. We are not experts, so we do always encourage you to seek support first and foremost from a medical and/or mental health professional as needed. Doree, did we have a lot
Elise Hu (00:46):
Of notes and texts and voicemails pile up while we were off? I'm so curious because I don't field them all.
Doree Shafrir (00:55):
I would say not a ton. Okay. We got a few. To be fair, they are the
Elise Hu (01:02):
Dead weeks. So what I love about the dead weeks is sort of this period in which you don't know what time it is or what day it is and you're in this kind of vortex. And as a result, I can totally understand why you wouldn't think to be emailing or texting your favorite podcasters. So I can't wait to hear what we do have in store, like what you did write about, but you can always write in now that we're back in 2026, back in action.
Doree Shafrir (01:32):
We are back in action. You can call or text us at 781-591-0390. Email us as always at forever35podcast@gmail.com. We love getting your questions, your comments, your concerns. So please write or call in. But before we get to everything that you all did correspond with us about, Elise, how are you doing now in the new year?
Elise Hu (02:00):
I feel good. I feel pretty good. I mean, I'm glad that I didn't travel too much. I am actually in New York this week as this place. Yes. I am going to be in New York, but the girls get three weeks off, which feels like an interminably a long amount of time. And we got to do some fun things together here in town. Ava went down to Orange County where they have this winter fest. It rained a lot. I tried to keep the mud out of my house. That felt like a lot of how I spent the holidays. Rob's doing his thing of trying to prepare the girls to see Hamilton, so he's trying to give context. And then I were going to probably go to the Museum of Natural History. And so I showed Luna night at the museum, which I hadn't seen. Oh, cool.
(02:52)
And I'm so glad that I did. It was very cute. So I'm excited about that. But yeah, it was pretty quiet. I kind of tied one on New Year's Eve. It was really rainy, stayed out too late, but I feel pretty good. I'm not a big new year, new intentions kind of person, but I did get to see this really cool thing. I do a year-end wrap up every year. So I do try and take stock at the end of every year. And then that way I have that to look back on too. And that's kind of nice because I like to reflect. But I was watching this interview between Manush Zomarodi at NPR. She hosts TED RadioHour, the other TED related show. And she was talking to Krista Tippett, the
Doree Shafrir (03:35):
Big-spiritual
Elise Hu (03:38):
... Yeah, who hosts on being, and she's kind of like a spiritual thought leader. And she talked about how instead of going into the new year with any intentions or resolutions, you could, because it gives you kind of added pressure to try and implement them. One thing that she recommended is going into the new year with a question, like a question that becomes your friend throughout the year and you return to it and you kind of think about if you're working towards it, but just like having the idea of that question in your head will
(04:07)
Help you live differently. Manush wanted, I think her question for the year was something like, how do I spend time with ideas or think about them without just trying to grab onto them? Because I think as an interviewer and somebody who comes and is associated with Ted, there's ideas just coming at you all the time. And I think our tendency, especially as journalists, is to grab at them and figure out like, "Oh, well, this would pair with this other idea and then I can make this episode about this. " But instead, just actually think about ideas to then lead to other ideas. And so I'm trying to figure out what mine would be. I feel like mine is even broader if I were to come up with a new year's question and it would be like, how do I do things with more depth? How do I do things deeply?
(04:53)
It's not just work. I want to do deep work obviously, but
Doree Shafrir (04:57):
Work
Elise Hu (04:57):
Is just one dimension of our lives, but how do I pay attention more deeply? How do I read more deeply? I think that that could be something that then is an animating kind of challenge. But yeah, what about you? Catch me up. You had your big trip. Tell us highlights, low lights, memories, core memories.
Doree Shafrir (05:21):
Yeah. So we went to Mexico. My parents were generous enough to take us on a trip to Mexico with my brother and his kids. We all stayed at the same resort and it was a great trip. A bunch of people have been like, "Do you feel relaxed or rejuvenated?" And no, I don't because we were with three rambunctious children under 10 and there wasn't that much time to really relax on my own. But that being said, it was a really great trip. It was great to spend time with my brother and my parents and my brother's kids and Henry got a lot of cousin time and the resort was amazing and we did a couple of day trips.
Elise Hu (06:14):
I love hotel breakfast. What were the highlights for you of hotel breakfast? Did you have the same thing every day or?
Doree Shafrir (06:21):
Yeah, I usually would make some sort of chia yogurt bowl with fruit. They'd really nice fresh fruit. I don't love an omelet. I'm sort of omelet agnostic and there was always a line for the omelet station. So I never did an omelet. Henry always had eggs and pancakes. He was like in heaven with his eggs and pancakes. There was a restaurant, it was an all- inclusive resort where we stayed and there was a restaurant near our room that was really nice. It was like right by the beach. It was like basically like in the infinity pool and it wasn't as crowded as like the ... There were two sort of main buffets and it was not nearly as crowded. It just felt sort of like a nice, peaceful way to start the day. The rest of my family tended to eat breakfast at a much more crowded location with a lot of kids.
(07:14)
And almost every day we just kind of did our own thing. So that was nice. But we usually had like lunch and dinner together.
Elise Hu (07:25):
Nice.
Doree Shafrir (07:27):
Yeah. Yeah.
Elise Hu (07:28):
What about Matt? Did he have a good time do you think?
Doree Shafrir (07:31):
He did have a good time and he was like a little apprehensive about the trip, partly because he's a bigger guy, so he knew that he wasn't going to be able to do some of the activities,
(07:47)
Which was like obviously not great and a little stressful for him. And I think he's also a person who is a little nervous about unfamiliar situations and like we were going to a foreign country and he kind of likes to be prepared and he didn't really know how to be prepared in this situation, but he really rose to the occasion and admitted that he had a good time and he did a lot of walking, which he doesn't normally do that much of at home. And I think that sort of like jump started a walking habit for him, so that was good.
Elise Hu (08:29):
Also, it's just like good vibes to be so far from home
Doree Shafrir (08:33):
In
Elise Hu (08:33):
Mexico.
Doree Shafrir (08:34):
It was good vibes. Henry really, the first couple days were tough. Henry really likes his routines. He likes his schedule. He likes his familiar surroundings. And the first couple days he was just a little like out of sorts. I was like, " I've never been here before. "I was like, " True, that's fair. "I was like, " Are you feeling like disoriented? "And then he kind of got into it and got into the rhythm and the food and just the whole vibe and I think ended up having a lot of fun. It was great.
Elise Hu (09:07):
He'll be such a pro next time too when he's at the next place that he's never been before.
Doree Shafrir (09:12):
Totally, totally. Well, Elise, before we take a little break, I do just want to play a sweet voicemail
Listener Voicemail (09:21):
That we got. Okay. Hi, I am a forever, Forever35 listener. And I just had a call because I finished listening to the episode with Megan and I noticed she was super anxious to open herself up to answering any questions that come. So I don't have a question for her at the time, but I feel like she needs to be a repeat guest because she was incredible and I love you too also. Anyway, thank you so much, you guys, for the podcast. You get me through so much. Love you, bye. I
Elise Hu (09:57):
Agree about Dr. Megan Sullivan and how I hope that she can come on more. I feel like the questions that she wrestles with all the time are ones that overlap so much with our daily lives and just trying to be an adult or a human in the world. And she did a great job. She crushed it. Agree.
Doree Shafrir (10:16):
Yes.
Elise Hu (10:16):
She probably agree. We were talking about maybe trying to send her voice notes or something that we get from our listeners. But she did take one of those listener questions that we had from
Doree Shafrir (10:26):
A mini. She did. She did. And I thought she did a really good job answering it. And then just one more quick thing before we take a break. We got a text that said, just wanted to share that as a board certified dermatologist and longtime Forever35 fan, I was so impressed with your episode with Dr. Wong. I do not know her, but it was refreshing to hear her answer listener questions in the same way that I would when speaking with my own patients in clinic with clarity, without gimmicks, kudos to you and to her.
Elise Hu (10:59):
Yeah. Thanks, Dr. Wall. I need to go pay a visit to my dermatologist. Yeah.
Doree Shafrir (11:06):
She was so great.
Elise Hu (11:06):
I very rarely go, so I should probably do that. Maybe do a little skin check or something.
Doree Shafrir (11:11):
Yeah. Take that as a sign. All right. We are going to take a break and after the break, we have an interesting question about having kids. Oh, okay. So we will be right back. We'll be right back.
(11:35)
Okay. We are back. Just a reminder, you can visit our website, forever35podcast.com. We have links there to everything we mentioned on the show. We are on Instagram @Forever35podcast. Our Patreon is patreon.com/forever35. We are now doing our weekly casual chats on video, so you have the option to watch us, pretty exciting, and/or listen to us. I suppose you could watch without listening, but that would probably be a little boring. And we're also going to be doing quarterly live casual chats for our Patreon or paid Patreon subscribers. So if you are interested in that, head on over patreon.com/forever35 and join us there. You can also join as a free member and get our newsletter, which is now on Patreon. Okay. We have a voicemail.
Listener Voicemail (12:29):
Hi, Doree and Elise. Piggybacking off the question you responded to recently about deciding whether to have a child. I was child free and on the fence, but leaning toward no kids for a long time. But fast forward to the beginning of 2026 here, I am in my late 30s now and the mom of a one-year-old. I love her very much finding a lot of joy in being a mom, but to be honest, it's also been pretty challenging in terms of things like sleep and balancing work and other commitments. And I feel a lot of worry and guilt when I think about her not having a sibling long term, but I also don't know if my partner and I really realistically have bandwidth for more. And when people hear that we probably won't have a second one because we don't have much of the quote unquote village, they've told me that we're actually shooting ourselves in the foot and that it's a shortsighted view because if you have one child, you actually have to entertain them a lot more and you won't have as much time for yourself as if there were two of them because then they can play with each other.
(13:37)
And I just was curious if you think this is true or is this just our pro- natalist culture pushing the idea that more kids is better? I don't think the idea that two siblings keeping each other company is in and of itself a good reason to bring another kid into the world, but I would be really curious to hear your perspective as parents of one and three children respectively. How do you feel like having a single versus multiple children affects your ability to care for yourself on a daily basis when you think about things like exercise, your social life, hobbies, sleep, et cetera. Obviously the best choice for optimal self-care probably would've been to remain child free, but since that ship has sailed for me, what do we think? Thanks.
Elise Hu (14:21):
First, I think this would be such a good question for Dr. Megan Sullivan. Totally. Totally. Because there's a lot of value that our relationships add that aren't valued the same by different people. So you and I might value our free time differently or whatever it is, like what we do. So I can't really answer that question. I feel like one versus three or one versus five kids is always such an individual question and it has a lot to do, not just with your own personal philosophy, but also resources. I would have more than three kids if I were richer. I just think they're so expensive. And then with each kid, it is, we have a finite amount of time. So with each additional child I have or had, I had a diminishing marginal resource of that time. So it's like inevitable that my kids get less of me as I had more of them, but they have value to each other.
(15:28)
Do they have that much value to each other? Do they really love and cherish all the time they spend with each other? I don't know about that, but they have relationships with one another and a certain kind of connection that I can't really put a value on.
Doree Shafrir (15:42):
Yeah. I mean, I think it is kind of true that like at least at the age that Henry is right now, he's six. He does want us to play. He still wants us to play with him a lot. He's starting to play more on his own and do more things on his own, but not really. And I think kind of like socially and for his own development, it probably would have been great for him to have a sibling, but it just wasn't in the cards. So I mean, personally, and this is like my personal belief, I think like all things being equal, it's like nice to have a sibling, but there's people who disagree with me and I think you can have a perfectly fulfilling, your child have a perfectly fulfilling life, you will have a perfectly fulfilling life with one child or no children.
(16:42)
So that's how I feel personally, but another kid is not going to happen, so we're kind of like making the best ... And I think also, we also acknowledge some of the things that this listener is saying in their voicemail, which is like, and what you have also said too, Elise, the finite resources, like we are in a very precarious financial situation right now that I can't even imagine what would be like if we had more than one child. And there's a lot of things that we get to do because we only have one child. And so I think that's very real. And I actually know a lot of people who have one child and I think they also see how it benefits the family unit to have one child. So I don't think any of us can tell you what to do and like what the right choice is.
(17:45)
I think all we can do is speak from our own experience and whatever choice you make will end up being the right choice for you, I think. I don't know if that sounds like wishy-washy, but I do genuinely feel that way.
Elise Hu (17:59):
I'd ask yourself how important it is to you to have another child too. Ask yourself maybe from the perspective of your future self, do you feel like you would regret it if had you not? And that could be a way to test how meaningful it is to you or how ambivalent you are about it. And it's okay to be ambivalent about it. So many of our lives are just full of surprises that we don't have the privilege of thinking this deeply about in the first place. Totally. It's cool that you're thinking about it and are being intentional about it.
Doree Shafrir (18:39):
I mean, these are some of the biggest questions that people wrestle with. I mean, even Dr. Megan Sullivan was saying she was wrestling with this too.
Elise Hu (18:49):
And that it's the most enduring question in all of philosophy or something. I was like, "Do you have a child and what's the value of having a child and what's the value of having the next child?" So yeah. So I don't want to say any of this to say to be dismissive of any of my children. So for anybody, for Ava, Issa or Luna, if you're listening, I love you very much. I'm so glad you're here.
Doree Shafrir (19:13):
All right. We have another kind of big question to get to after the break. And Elise, this one will be more directed to you, so I just want you to be ready for it.
Elise Hu (19:29):
All right.
Doree Shafrir (19:31):
It's about co-parenting.
Elise Hu (19:33):
All right. That is coming up after the break.
Doree Shafrir (19:36):
We'll be right back. All right. We are back. As promised, we have another voicemail.
Listener Voicemail (19:51):
Hey friends, longtime caller, longtime listeners wondering, and this is maybe something that you have covered in the past, so forgive me for this. If you could talk some about co-parenting for folks who are separated and divorced. Elise, I know this is something that you navigate yourself. I know there are a lot of listeners navigating it. It's something that I'm just figuring out with two young children and there are hard things and good things. And I would just really love to hear all the different ways that folks are thinking about it and at least maybe how you have worked through it yourself and how it relates to self-care and stuff in midlife, particularly for women and sems. And yeah, I just think this would be a really great help to me if this is something that folks would be willing to talk about. And I appreciate y'all very much.
Elise Hu (20:45):
The part where my ears perked up was when you said, especially as it relates to women and femmes, because if you are in a heterosexual relationship and that heterosexual relationship is splitting up, then often what happens is your relationship, whether you were together or apart, still has the same kinds of overfunctioning and underfunctioning roles and responsibilities. So in the same way that I was having to manage the kids' schedules when I was married, I'm still managing the kids' schedules for the most part when I'm not married and my ex- husband executes on that schedule, whereas I have to be the keeper of it. And so I don't love that. I don't love that. Not my favorite, not my favorite. And obviously him being a single parent now means that he's really had to step up in planning for the day and all of that when he is in charge of the girls, but
(21:40)
Usually their schedules have to be consistent across both parents. When they have volleyball games or dance practice or whatever, and it's regularly during his time, it's not like it changes because it's his time, it's still happening. So super structure wise, just like practical, actionable things that I think have been helpful is that Maddie and I try and have a call once a week just to talk about the weekend ahead. I love that. And this totally depends on your relationship with your ex too. Some people don't talk to their exes at all and don't want to, and so they try and keep it asynchronous communication. We are pretty friendly and so we talk to each other by phone once a week. And then when he's mad at me for whatever reason, because he still gets mad at me and there's ups and downs, then he doesn't want to talk.
(22:30)
And then I'm like, "Okay, great. Can I catch you when you're dropping off the kids?" And then I feel like, can we please try just for the sake of the kids to have some sort of structure that's easy for us? And then we have a shared calendar, so that helps. We have a shared calendar that's the kids stuff and we both see it and that way ... And that actually helps him because it reduces us having to talk to each other because he's like, "Is it on the calendar? Okay, great."
Doree Shafrir (22:58):
Do you guys ever do family meals?
Elise Hu (23:02):
I would love that. We did that at first. When we first put up, we still ate together every Friday and we do all the girls' birthdays together. We tried to have their birthday meal together. But now that Rob is more integrated in the family and Maddie and Rob aren't like buddies, I feel like it actually takes away from some of our original family gatherings from the girls' parent, the girls to biological parents. And so I know some great blended families who they all go on vacation together. The ex- husband, the ex- wife, their new husband, their new wife, all the kids and they're all like stepsiblings. And so there's awesome blended situations. I just think it so much varies.
Doree Shafrir (23:48):
And that was why I asked- Family to family. I've heard of people who do weekly dinners, although I feel like that's often like an early days of co-parenting thing that happens where they're sort of transitioning into this new world and then the family dinners sort of stop after a while, but I was just kind of curious what the-
Elise Hu (24:11):
For holiday gifts, we try and use some sort of Google Doc or something so we don't accidentally duplicate. And then we do parent teacher conferences together so that the teachers don't have to duplicate. So we go to all the concerts and recitals and things together, but then also we have a running WhatsApp chat with one another to share photos and things because I have to work all day today, for example, and the kids are supposed to be with me, but he was flexible enough to take all the girls and do quote unquote dad camp. And so they went bowling or something and he'll update me and send photos and things. Or if Ava has new headshots, I'll put them in a folder that's shared so that he can see everything too. We try to share all that media. That's another thing that we think about because inevitably one parent is like missing a lot of the things that they might have been there for previously.
(25:02)
Totally. But also you're getting a lot of time back too that you might have like doubled, the situations in which both parents were there.
Doree Shafrir (25:09):
Yes. Yes.
Elise Hu (25:11):
Yeah. I hope this kind of answers your question in a practical way because in a philosophical way, I can't really, or relational way, I can't really speak to it specifically because all of our situations are so different. And then also one thing that I would just keep in mind, since you're a caller who's like recently divorced or recently separated, is that your relationship with your co-parent is going to change just in the way that all relationships change and grow and evolve. And so just be open to how it doesn't stay exactly how it is right now. Sometimes for better, sometimes for a more frustrating result, but it changes. And so just be ready for all of the dynamism there.
Doree Shafrir (25:52):
Great advice. Thank you, Elise. Listeners, thank you so much for calling and writing in and we will talk to you soon.
Elise Hu (26:00):
Great. Talk next time. Bye.
Doree Shafrir (26:02):
Bye.