Mini-Ep 352: Everyone F*cks Up
Kate and Doree delight in all the pictures being sent to them by listeners and hear from them about their election feelings, dirty pajamas, flossing routines, and dealing with manager-employee issues at work.
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Transcript
Kate: Hello friends, and welcome to Forever35, a podcast about the things we do to take care of ourselves. I am Kate Spencer
Doree: And I'm Doree Shafrir.
Kate: And we are not experts.
Doree: We're not, but we are two friends who like to talk a lot about serums.
Kate: And this is a mini episode where we hear from you, we share your comments and your thoughts, and we answer your questions to the best of our ability
Doree: Indeed. But please to remember, we are podcast hosts. We're not experts. We always encourage you to seek support first and foremost, from a medical and or mental health professional as needed.
Kate: If you would like to reach us, our voicemail number is 7 8 1 5 9 1 0 3 9 0, and our email is Forever35podcast@gmail.com. And I did just wanna note Doree, folks are sending us, folks are sending us pictures all of a sudden, like pictures of what they're eating in the bathtub, pictures of their cut up products. Today we received an image of, oh, this is so great. I'm gonna post this on our Instagram. But someone who listens to the podcast and then draws what we're talking about. What, yes, this person said, I've decided my new thing is waking up to have my smoothie and coffee. Listen to you gals and pick one thing you say on the pod and draw it whilst listening. I found it a lovely ease into the day this morning. And then they drew a picture of a tennis racket with a ball.
Doree: That is so cool.
Kate: Isn't that cool? So all I'm saying is if you are inspired to send us photos, especially photos that we can share with our other listeners on Instagram or not, by all means send it.
Doree: Gosh, I can't wait to see this.
Kate: It's so sweet. I just thought that was such a nice way to start the morning that would've never dawned on me to listen to something and kind of draw and zone out in that way. So nice. Anyway, sorry. On top of that, you can visit our website forever35podcast@gmail.com for links to
Doree: Nope, nope, nope, nope.
Kate: Wow. Wow. I haven't done that in so long. I'm a little hyper. You can also visit our website Forever35podcast.com where we have links to everything we mention on the show. Twitter. Are we still on Twitter these days?
Doree: We're not talking about Twitter.
Kate: We're going to just forget about Twitter. But on Instagram, we're @Forever35podcast. And also on Facebook, you can find the Forever35 Facebook group where the password is serums,
Doree: And we also have a newsletter. You can sign up for that at Forever35podcast.com/newsletter. It comes out twice a month and you can shop all of our recommended products that shopmy.us/forever35. And don't forget that we have a collab. With Balance Bound that, you can shop balancebound.co/shop/forever35 makes a great gift.
Kate: stalking stuffer Hanukkah, an office gift.
Doree: Just so many go to so many possibilities,
Kate: So many choices for you if you are so inclined. Well, Doree. Hello. I did just wanna note that we're recording this the day after the midterm elections, and we received a couple texts yesterday and today kind of in regard to those things. One person texted us and they said, Kate, after your patriarchy rant on the latest episode, you sighed deeply and dejectedly proclaimed, I hate everything. I felt that sigh and sentiment in my soul. I am with you. You are not alone and feeling so helpless right now. It's election day and I'm not looking forward to election results, especially since I live in Ohio. Sending Love Your Way. Hope you can find some joy today. Oh, listener, I'm sorry. And I'm sorry that Ohio did not turn the way we had hoped on the national level,
Doree: But a lot of other things did.
Kate: Well, that is what the next message is about. Do you wanna read this text?
Doree: Sure. Just wanted to say thank you for fundraising for the Pennsylvania State races. Lots of love to you from Becky, a lifelong PA resident, woman and mom feeling a sense of relief today. The efforts never stop, but today I feel bit more hopeful for the future. 35 forever. Dr. Oz never
Kate: <laugh>, right? Dr. Oz? Never. So we are, it's post election day things are still kind of being hashed out. We don't know who the mayor is gonna be yet here in Los Angeles, for example. But we are really excited about how things are turning out in Pennsylvania which is where we all fundraised for with our Giving Circle and the State's project. So I'm feeling, I have to say hopeful today. I'm feeling a little a touch of relief and joy.
Doree: And also, just to be clear, we did not really have anything to do in terms of our giving circle with the Federman Oz race.
Kate: No, very psyched about it, but
Doree: No, yeah, really psyched about it. But we were raising money for down ballot state legislature races, and I know that we flipped a few seats. We're still, as of this recording, we're still waiting on some final results. But I'm excited about some of the results there. Kate, did you wanna talk about our little interaction before we started recording?
Kate: I do. I think we should just share an intimate moment that you and I just had so listeners behind the scenes, I have a faulty microphone and it often just does this thing or it shuts off in the middle of recording and I have to refresh and it's a nuisance. And every time,
Doree: And it's been going on for a few weeks, few weeks
Kate: At least,
Doree: Maybe not. And every time we record, Kate says, oh, I gotta get a new mic,
Kate: indeed. Or I have to figure out what it is. Is it the cord? Is it the microphone? I determined it's the microphone. Today this happened before we started recording this very episode, and Doree looked at me through the screen because we're at our homes. And she said, okay, you said what's happening now is an ADHD thing. You are going to get on Amazon right now and you're gonna order a new microphone. And I said, no. And you said, tough shit. I mean, not in these exact words, but I was like, and you were like, you we're just
Doree: Gonna do it my card that I, and I was like, what? No
Kate: Yeah. I have to order a bunch of weird things for this family cruise. I'm going on luggage tags and like a phone charger and I have all these things. I wanna an order. And you said, no, you are going online and we are finding you a microphone and we're gonna order it right now. And you sat there while I did it. I had to go get my wallet and I said, I have to go get my wallet. This is gonna take a minute. And you said, I don't care. You go get your wallet. And then I did it and I did it, and I ordered the microphone and it took two seconds.
Doree: Yeah. How long would you say the whole thing ended up taking Kate, even with going to get your wallet
Kate: Under five minutes.
Doree: Thank you.
Kate: You are my ADD coach.
Doree: I mean, look, I'm not, but I have picked up a few things from being married to my husband. There are just sometimes things that we need to get done. And I'm like, I will sit here with you. Or sometimes I'm like, I will go, even though this is your thing to handle, I will go with you to the DMV Because we need to get this done. And he's like, okay, fine.
Kate: I appreciate that too because I do think there's, when it comes to this specific brain that some of us have it's not that you are doing it for him, that we really actually do need the support to follow through on things. It's not like you're pander. There's a difference. I don't know if I'm making sense.
Doree: Well, it's the difference between me saying, Kate, I'm just gonna order this microphone for you.
Kate: Very, very true. Which you could have also done.
Doree: Which I totally could have done. And me saying, Kate, I'm gonna sit here while you ordered this microphone, and we're not starting to record until you order this microphone.
Kate: Now, I do wanna note, I am in my, I dream of this. I need to find someone who will do this with me professionally. When I was in high school although no one diagnosed me with ADD back then, but I had an organizational tutor every Monday night, I would go to her house and we would organize my binders every week.
Doree: Whoa, That's cool.
Kate: It was very cool. You would've thought that someone, that would've been a red flag that I needed that. And someone would've been like, let's connect the dots. But I'm still working out.
Doree: It was the nineties.
Kate: I'm working that anger out in therapy.
Doree: I feel like there was so much that people didn't connect the dots on, especially with girls. It's like Kate just need some help organizing.
Kate: Anyway, thank you for doing that with me. And what I will say, can I tell you an all honesty? I had a moment where I felt ashamed, like, oh, this is embarrassing that I can't, this is a thing I haven't been able to follow through on. And I was embarrassed and I felt like that tinge of shame. And then I was like, no, I'm not ashamed. You're my friend who understands me and you're helping me. And it's not coming from a place of scolding. And I think that's another thing, no. That I've had to really begin to work on as an adult. So I just wanted to note that.
Doree: Well, and for me, as the neurotypical half of this partnership, and other partnerships, I really seem to get myself into these situations. I think it's also, I've had to just realize, well, this benefits me too.
Kate: Yes. Yeah, it does
Doree: I mean, no offense, I'm not just doing it for you,
Kate: none taken. But I do feel like you need to sit down with Anthony and be like, Hey, here are some hot tips on how to handle a spouse like this.
Doree: That's a lot of mental load for me to take on Kate.
Kate: That's fair. I'll find a man to do it. Alright, well, I think we should take a little break and when we come back we'll hear for some listeners.
Doree: All right. We are back with an email that is, I know we get a lot of great emails and there's a lot of emails that have been like, this is my favorite email and I don't wanna play favorites. But this was one of those emails that I immediately sent to Kate and she was like, oh my God, yes, I saw this email too. And we were both just like, oh my gosh, this email.
Kate: We were moved. We were both moved.
Doree: Now I will read it to you. Hi Kate and Doree. I have a thought for the reader with the niche friendship question. My situation is very different. I am 62, and in the past year I lost my two dearest friends, one to an accident and one to cancer. They were my people, friends from childhood friends who I could talk to about anything and laugh like crazy with friends who I saw often and talk to almost daily. The loss has left me stunned and with a deep loneliness that I never expected to experience. I've been trying some new things to make connections. I started a part-time job and I've joined a foreign language learning group. My therapist suggested finding a walking group. I found one on Facebook, and it's been a blessing. It's very casual. People post a meetup day and location, and you can pop in if you are in the mood. No real commitment, a casual stroll and chat situation. The best part, everyone is looking ahead and not staring at each other. Great for an introvert like me. I figure if no one shows up, at least I'm out enjoying the fresh air and getting some exercise and listening to my pals, Kate and Doree. Highly recommend xo. Xo.
I mean, every time I read this email, it almost makes me cry. So just happened again.
Kate: I mean, the loss of friends is so, I don't think there's any other loss like it. I mean, you can say that about the loss of any other person in your life, but it's just really profound. And this made me actually think of my mom's friends and what it must have been like for them when she passed. Cuz I had selfishly never really given that much thought. It was very me, my grief, which is fine. But yeah, just thinking about what it's like to lose a friend in that way. And also just how moving it is about the aftermath and how we find ways to move forward. I was so touched by this. Anyway, thank you so much for sharing, lister. We're sorry for your losses, but yeah, we're very inspired by you, and thank you for taking us with you on your walks.
Doree: Yeah. Also, sounds like you have a great therapist.
Kate: I know this therapist sounds awesome.
Doree: I'm just like, I'm so moved by this. Okay.
Kate: Okay, an email, Dear Kate and Doree, thoughts on finding closure after a work snafu. For context, I'm in the middle of my PhD program, and due to multiple conflicting responsibilities and a healthy dose of burnout, I let my communication with a project supervisor slide. We don't work in the same location, so I rarely checked in with her. Anyway, in the last few weeks, there were a series of emails in which I didn't perceive an action item or requested response on my end, but today I got an email pointing out the several things I had done wrong or not responded to. I sent an email apologizing, but I do feel like the bridge is burned based on her tone. Not a huge deal because we are closing the project anyway, but it felt pretty awful. Anyway, this is the first time I've been seen as unprofessional or incompetent by someone for not following up. I do take responsibility for the situation, but I also misunderstood her emails and I obviously didn't do that on purpose. And it just feels crappy to receive an accusatory angry email. Curious what your experiences are with these types of feeling in a professional context. And any advice for ways to find closure on my own and try to move from here on would be appreciated.
My first response, which might be trying to rewrite history, you may not be able to do this now, but my first response is when stuff is going on over email to immediately take it to a phone call because, or in person or a Zoom or whatever. But where you can communicate back and forth, have a conversation and hear each other out. So that I think for many of us, it's easier to really articulate and clarify a situation and things get so lost over email.
Doree: I agree. I think the other thing that can be helpful, and I don't know what your PhD is in, and I don't know if this is something that is doable, but it, I mean, I don't totally get the relationship here. It's your project supervisor. It sounds like in a workplace, she would be your manager. This is bad management on her part.
Kate: Here we go.
Doree: Okay. If there was a series of emails in which I didn't perceive an action item or requested response, and then she lets all of that slide for weeks, and then sends you an email being like, why didn't you do all this stuff? I mean, to me that's a management failure on her part. Why did she check in with you?
Kate: I'm liking this so
Doree: Like's number one. Number two is I think I agree with Kate's advice about the phone call, and I don't think it's too late. I think you can say, I would try to hash this out with this person over a phone call or even over a Zoom. And if they refuse to do that, that is again to me, a sign of a poor manager. And I would request a weekly in person, meaning on Zoom or phone call check in.
Kate: Aha.
Doree: Because that way nothing gets lost. You can go over what you've been working on. They can reiterate things that are important because it also sounds to me like this person did not adequately communicate priorities and what was expected. So again, poor management
Kate: And you've been a manager. So I do feel like
Doree: And what I've been a mediocre manager and I know the signs of a mediocre manager and I see it here.
Kate: Interesting. So you see that, I mean, becoming a manager is hard. It's so strange to me that people just become managers without training. I was managing people and I never was taught how to manage.
Doree: No. And it's hard and it's not for everyone. And it also sounds to me, reading between the lines here, it sounds to me it's a similar situation. And I could be totally off base here, but you have this PhD project supervisor who is essentially in the position of a manager, but may not even see themselves as a manager. And maybe doesn't fully understand their own role and what they are supposed to be expecting of people. So I think you need to clear the air. And I think the way to do that is a phone call or a Zoom, or even meeting in person. I know you don't work in the same location, but maybe you could just get coffee or something with this person and try to take it down a notch. You know what I mean?
Kate: And let's say this doesn't get resolved.
I think you have to, there are always gonna be moments in time where we disappoint people professionally. Either we make a mistake or they interpret something as a mistake. And I think those are the times where we need to dig deep and know that one mistake, one fuck up doesn't reflect the entire capacity of our ability or our work. And look preaching at this, I'm telling this to myself, I'm haunted by mistakes I made in middle school, but no one is a hundred percent at everything we do. That's just, it's impossible. Even if you weren't burnt out and in a PhD program, even if you were very relaxed and feeling chill at work, I don't know. So grace, if this person's not gonna give you grace, you still have to dig it outta yourself.
Doree: I think that's all really good advice.
Kate: We are geniuses, that's what I'm getting at. But anyway, listener, keep us posted. I would love to know how you resolve this. The other thing I do just wanna remind us all is that everyone fucks up. Everyone makes mistakes at work. Yeah. Sometimes huge mistakes. Huge.
Doree: Totally. Totally. Yeah.
Kate: I mean, not to bring up Twitter, but look at its new owner.
Doree: I mean,
Kate: Just really fucking up left and right.
Doree: Yikes. Yikes.
Kate: And people think that guy's a genius. Not here on this podcast, but
Doree: No, no.
Kate: Anyway, he should not be named on that note. Let's take a break.
Doree: Okay. Okay, we are back. Hi Kate and Doree. Question. How long do you and any listeners wear pajamas before washing them? I recently saw an influencer say she wears hers for one night and then they go in the laundry. And I go much longer than that. Am I gross? Do I need more PJs? Love the pod and both of you so much.
Kate: Okay. So this has come up on this podcast before. Because we were talking about wearing underpants with our pajamas. And I was like, I don't, and then someone wrote in and was like, don't you have to wash your pajamas every day? And I was like, I don't, am I gross? Question mark. I'm gonna just announce that I don't think I don't fancy myself gross. And you do you. I'm sure people will write in and tell me that this is bad. The same way that when I revealed I had products near my toilet, I was told that poop particles were flying all over my products. But this seems excessive to wash your pajamas unless you're night sweating or menstruating. What Doree, take the mic. What do you do?
Doree: I wash my pajamas once a week.
Kate: Nice. So you wear the same ones all week?
Doree: I usually wear the same ones all week. Sometimes I mix it up a little bit, but I usually wear the same ones all week. And then if something happens, yeah, I don't know,
Kate: Do you sweat at night?
Doree: Yea or in the morning if I spill something. Cause I usually wear my pajamas until before. I'll get Henry still in my pajamas. We'll play and eat breakfast and get ready for school and then I will change. So I'm wearing my pajamas for an hour in the morning. And so if something happens to them, then obviously I'll change. Ill wash them. But usually I'm not changing them every night. Henry's pajamas get washed every night, which is sort of a relic of, I think being a baby and poop and pee leaking onto his pajamas all the time.
Kate: Oh, to be a baby.
Doree: I know. But now he still wears pullups at night, but he hasn't. He occasionally leaks, but he usually doesn't. But I still wash his pajamas. I don't know. I probably don't have to, but I do. Anyway.
Kate: Yeah, I mean, I would love to know what people do, but I kind of feel like this idea that we need to be washing our pajamas after one use is a very modern folks weren't doing that 200 years ago.
Doree: No,
Kate: It's a little, this hyper cleanliness is like, I think it's kinda a lot. Yeah.
Doree: But again, I mean, I wasn't think I was doing this as a kid.
Kate: Oh my God. No. I don't remember washing. This is not I, no recollection.
Doree: Okay.
Kate: All right,
Doree: Kate, we have a voicemail to round out the show.
Voicemail: Hi. Pause the pod moment, talking about flossing. I actually will credit my new flossing habits to the Forever35 podcast. And just, I've always wanted to be a flosser and just always end of the night it's like, oh, I'm too tired. Oh, I don't wanna do this. But then in getting into a more regular nighttime skincare routine, I realize if I'm spending all this time on my skin, I do have enough time to also floss my teeth in addition to brushing and mouthwash. So I now sort of insert my flossing while I'm waiting for my first layer of serum to sink in or whatever I have on my skin resting before my next step. I will get out my philosopher picks and do it. And I last on my dentist at the end of August, and now's the beginning of November. I have every single night since then.
It's truly the longest streak of my 37 years on this planet. And specifically the flossers I'm using, I get them on Amazon and they're called Plackers. And I like them better than the ones I found at drugstores because they have two strips of floss. So it's not the one piece of floss that's gonna come right at your gums and cut you. There's two of them. And it just feels like it's a little smoother. And it also I feel is really thorough. So I'll just say thank you to my dedication to serums for helping me become a dedicated flosser and hope you all have a good day. Bye.
Kate: Okay. Do you know what cracked me up about this? Is early on, I'm talking like month one or two of Forever35. You talked about Plackers. I did. I will never forget it.
Doree: I was wondering if you would remember.
Kate: Of course I do. In fact, Anthony has Plackers and every time I think about you constantly, every time I see Plackers, in fact, I'll only ever, I will always associate Plackers with you.
Doree: Aw, I'm so touched.
Kate: Yeah, it's an honor.
Doree: Yeah. I actually no longer use Plackers, I switched to regular old floss.
Kate: Is that because of the environmental impact of
Doree: Yeah, it was just, I don't know, it was just a lot of plastic single use plastic. And I was just like, I can deal with floss. You know what I mean? It's fine. I use Cocofloss, which I like. And they send you refills, so you also can reuse your plastic floss container.
Kate: Oh, that's nice.
Doree: They send you refills in little cardboard, tiny little cardboard boxes.
Kate: Oh, I love that.
Doree: Which is cool. And I like their floss and they come in some fun flavors. So yeah, recommend Cocofloss.
Kate: I'm just like a glide user.
Doree: I feel like I used to use Glide. I feel like once you use Cocofloss you're like, oh, this is better.
Kate: I've used Cocofloss, I didnt like it better.
Doree: You didn't like it?
Kate: I like it. Fine. I think we talked, we got a lot of floss recommendations at one point. And I also feel like friend of the pod, Jackie Johnson is a cocoflosser, if I remember correctly. But I went back to Glide. But I do like this refill concept, so maybe I will circle back. We'll see. I did wanna note that I do what this listener does, so I will often, I'll do both at the same time. I'll put on a serum floss really fast, do my moisturizer, try to knock it all out.
Doree: Okay.
Kate: Well, what fun this has been
Doree: Truly, and I'm excited for your new microphone.
Kate: It will be here tomorrow. I mean, look how fast that is.
Doree: Wow. I know.
Kate: It'll be here tomorrow, or it could have been here in six months if I had done it without you, so thank
Doree: You. Oh wow. Okay. All right. Bye everyone.
Kate: Bye.