Episode 395: Who You Are Without All The Stuff with Hayley DeRoche
Hayley DeRoche (you may know her as @sadbeige on TikTok) — a humorist, poet, and public librarian, joins the the show to discuss how her funny take on late stage capitalism launched her internet career and her new satirical book “Dress You Baby in Sage and Taupe.” They also chat about her thoughts on parents being their child’s first influencer as the purchaser of everything they consume, friendship and love that grows in parenting in community, and how “analog” is just another word for some of the most human things about life.
Photo Credit: Lindsey Windlett
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Transcript
Doree Shafrir (00:10):
Hello and welcome to Forever35, a podcast about the things we do to take care of ourselves. I'm Doree Shafrir.
Elise Hu (00:16):
And I'm Elise Hu and we're just two friends who like to talk a lot about serums.
Doree Shafrir (00:20):
And today we have Hayley DeRoche on the show. You may know her better by her social media moniker, Sadbeige. As she's known on Instagram, Official Sad Beige. I have been a follower of Hailey's for a long, long time. I love everything she does on social media and her writing. And she has a new book out called The Sad Beige Parents Handbook. So we had a great conversation. She's so smart and so perceptive. And yeah, I think you'll really enjoy our chat. Elise, what's going on with you?
Elise Hu (00:58):
I know that our show open line is that we talk about serums, but I just wanted to do a quick shout out for my Tacha Matcha. It rhymes. There is a Tacha Matcha cleanser that's the Macha Cleanse by Tacha. And I'm now using it to wash my face and I really like it. I really like it. I believe Rob has stolen it a few times because I find it in the shower sometimes.
Doree Shafrir (01:28):
How dare he? I
Elise Hu (01:30):
Know. But when I find it in the shower, I know he's used it because he washes his face in the shower, as is his want. And so I'm like, "Ugh, this is my fancy Tacha matcha. Why is it next to the hair
Doree Shafrir (01:42):
Conditioner?" He doesn't even have the decency to put it back in the right
Elise Hu (01:46):
Place. Nope.
Doree Shafrir (01:49):
Wow. He
Elise Hu (01:50):
Does
Doree Shafrir (01:50):
Not know how to cover his tracks.
Elise Hu (01:53):
No, not at all. The other day I woke up in the morning and there was half a glass of wine in the bathroom in the sink and I'm like, "Your bedtime wine was still in the bathroom. Put it away."
Doree Shafrir (02:07):
Wow. Well,
Elise Hu (02:08):
Because I don't like the kids leaving errant glasses all over the house. And so when an adult leaves an errant glass in the house, I have to call them out on it. I'm just like, "No, I'm not going to pick up after this. I'm just going to leave it here as a protest until you get it.
Doree Shafrir (02:23):
" That's so funny. Is this a Tacha product that you got on your tennis retreat?
Elise Hu (02:29):
Yes. That's how I even got introduced to it in the first place. And the other product from it, which was like the moisturizer that I had to open while I was out there in the desert because I forgot to bring my moisturizer. That's gone missing completely.
Doree Shafrir (02:47):
Excuse me.
Elise Hu (02:49):
Yeah. So I don't know if maybe one of the daughters stole it. I am a victim of theft.
Doree Shafrir (02:56):
Yes, you are.
Elise Hu (02:57):
You
Doree Shafrir (02:58):
Are.
Elise Hu (02:58):
I'm consistently getting things stolen. Well, skincare items stolen by two out of the three daughters, maybe all three daughters. And I can never keep a Lenege lip sleeping mask or whatever to save my life. I will have three new ones or something that a friend of mine will bring me back from Korea and I can't keep them for more than like 12 hours before they just disappear. So yeah, I don't know. I don't know what happened to my moisturizer. It's gone. And then we know what happened to my Tacha Matcha cleanse. It just gets used in the shower sometimes, but at least it's still, I can still identify where it is.
Doree Shafrir (03:40):
I feel like you need to watch your back with all your products.
Elise Hu (03:43):
I truly do. And my chargers. That's a problem.
Doree Shafrir (03:46):
Wow.
Elise Hu (03:46):
Chargers, charging cables. You know what I need to do is not live with so many roommates. That's what I need.
Doree Shafrir (03:53):
You need your own place.
Elise Hu (03:55):
Right. How do I not live with my children?
Doree Shafrir (03:59):
Oh my gosh. Maybe you should have moved into the Hugh Hideaway.
Elise Hu (04:02):
Right.
Doree Shafrir (04:04):
Be like, Rob, now that you're here,
Elise Hu (04:06):
I'm done. We're going to switch.
Doree Shafrir (04:08):
Yeah.
Elise Hu (04:11):
You've got this. You've got this buddy.
Doree Shafrir (04:13):
It's all
Elise Hu (04:14):
Good. Anyway, what about you? What's happening? You're here this weekend, this upcoming weekend, right?
Doree Shafrir (04:22):
I am here this upcoming weekend. I'm playing in a tennis match on Saturday that was originally going to be at 1:00 PM deep in the valley,
Elise Hu (04:33):
And it's going
Doree Shafrir (04:34):
To be very hot. And it just got rescheduled for 8:30 AM, which
Elise Hu (04:40):
I am
Doree Shafrir (04:40):
Delighted by.
Elise Hu (04:42):
What a relief.
Doree Shafrir (04:43):
What a relief, indeed. I mean, at least I wasn't going to be playing singles, but even playing doubles at 1:00 PM, like full sun. It's just, yeah, it's a little rough. And then, yeah, I don't know. I'm really bad at planning stuff for my kid. And I just looked at our calendar and he usually does this math class on Sundays, but they're on break. So he doesn't have it on Sunday. So Sunday is wide open and I'm like
Elise Hu (05:16):
... Well, it'll be warm enough for the beach if y'all want to do a beach day, I think.
Doree Shafrir (05:20):
Yeah, maybe we should just do a beach day. I've been talking about maybe doing a beach day.
Elise Hu (05:24):
That's not a
Doree Shafrir (05:24):
Bad idea.
Elise Hu (05:27):
Because I was looking at camps already because it's about that time to start looking at summer camps, things to do for the kids. And there was one that I was looking at that they have a field trip once a week for the day campers, and it's like to laser tag. And there was one that was standup paddle boarding/kayaking day. And I'm just like, "Oh, these are great weekend activities. Why don't I do this? " One of them was like, "Escape room." Oh, I should take the kids to these places. On the weekends, maybe that would be fun. But yeah, it is spring break either this week or next week. It's spring break all over the place. And so air travel has been a mess. You should have seen LAX. When I was coming back. And that was just normal spring break travel. People trying to get to the airport.
Doree Shafrir (06:18):
Yes.
Elise Hu (06:19):
It took 40 minutes after you were already on Sepulveda past the parking spot place where you can park and then ...
Doree Shafrir (06:27):
What?
Elise Hu (06:28):
Yeah. And so it was just really hard to get into the airport itself. And that's typical, I guess, around winter travel and spring travel, but then some of the airports around the nation because of the government or the TSA funding stoppage, those TSA lines seem like nightmares. Yeah. Three hours in Atlanta.
Doree Shafrir (06:49):
I've been seeing a lot of Reddit posts of specific airports like JFK seems really bad. Atlanta is really bad. San Diego also really
Elise Hu (07:01):
Bad. I really hope that gets resolved soon. Yes,
Doree Shafrir (07:05):
Me too.
Elise Hu (07:05):
As I feel about all the wars that are going on.
Doree Shafrir (07:09):
Seriously. My God. Well, before I introduce Hayley,
(07:14)
I just want to remind everyone that you can call or text us at 781-591-0390 or email us at forever35podcast@gmail.com. And we love getting your emails, your texts, your voice memos, because we use them for our mini episodes where we respond to you and your questions. And so yeah, so please call in, text in, write in, et cetera. You can visit our website, forever35podcast.com for links to everything we mention on the show. We are also on Instagram at Forever35podcast. We also have our Patreon at patreon.com/forever35, and we will be recording a live casual chat on Wednesday, April 8th at 1:30 Pacific, 4:30 Eastern. So join the Patreon before that so you can join our casual chat and you can ask us questions and we will be chatting with you guys and with each other. And last time we did it, it was super fun. We're doing these quarterly or roughly quarterly
(08:16)
In addition to our weekly, just regular casual chats, which we are now doing on video. So if you are a video person, you can check those out. You can also just join our Patreon at the free level to get access to the semi-monthly newsletter where we discuss pod highlights, product reviews, exclusive discounts, giveaways, and more bonus content. And then at the $5 level, you get access to the casual chat, which again is now on video. You get our live casual chats, you get access to our community discussion on the Patreon app. And at $10 a month, you get ad free episodes and a shout out on the podcast every month. So that is our Patreon again at patreon.com/Febr35. And now I will introduce Hailey, who is a humorist and poet and the creator of the viral Sad Beige TikTok series. Her work has been covered by the BBC, Washington Post, New York Times and more.
(09:08)
And her book, Dress Your Baby in Sage and Tope, a handbook for the Sad Beige Parent is out on April 21st. So do pre-order it. Pre-orders really help. And she lives with her family near Richmond, Virginia, where she is also a public librarian.
Elise Hu (09:23):
I didn't know that. Yeah.
Doree Shafrir (09:25):
Yeah. She's a librarian.
Elise Hu (09:26):
Oh, that's very cool.
Doree Shafrir (09:28):
And she had reserved a room at the library to record our interview. That
Elise Hu (09:33):
Is so sweet. I'm really sorry to have missed this one. So Dori is piloting this interview and then I will be back at the end for intentions.
Doree Shafrir (09:40):
Yeah. All right. Here's Hailey. Hayley, welcome to Forever35. It is really great to see you. I have been a fan of your work for a very, very long time and it's great to just get to chat. Thank
Hayley DeRoche (09:56):
You so much. I'm so happy to be here. This is so exciting.
Doree Shafrir (09:59):
Hey. This is exciting. And we get to talk about your book. I'm very excited. But as you may know, we start off our conversations with all of our guests by asking them about a self-care practice that they have. And so I'm wondering if there is something that you do these days that you would consider self-care?
Hayley DeRoche (10:22):
Well, let's see. I actually started at the beginning of the year writing a poem before I go to bed every night and I find it to be very grounding because I'm not necessarily putting my phone down because I do tend to write them in my notes app. So full disclosure. This is not screen-free time, but I just find it's nice to have that little ritual at the end of the day and it kind of forces me to think creatively before I go to bed. And it's been this really freeing practice. And I know if I forget one night, it's fine, but it's been really good for me. Yeah.
Doree Shafrir (10:57):
How did you come to this?
Hayley DeRoche (11:01):
That's a good question. I have just started doing more poetry in general lately, and at the beginning of the year, I was just like, "I need to do something more concrete than this haphazard projects that I've currently got going on. "
Doree Shafrir (11:16):
That's really cool. So we're just going to take a short break and we will be right back. Before we get to Sad Beige and the book, could you just give our listeners just a little bit of background of who you are and what you do and how you kind of came to embody the Sad Beige persona?
Hayley DeRoche (11:45):
Originally, I started out doing foster care content on TikTok in early 2021. And then after my family's journey transitioned into adoption, I kind of shifted my content over to comedy. And one day I was shopping for a baby shower and came across these stacking cups, stacking rings that were very sad beige colors. I made a joke on the internet and it turned into this whole viral series where I'm pretending to be a German nihilist filmmaker, Werner Hertzog. And I would just come on the screen and be like, "Welcome to Vernar Hartsock's new line of children's toys." And so that kind of catapulted my comedy career,
Elise Hu (12:36):
Which
Hayley DeRoche (12:36):
Is very exciting, which I'd done a little bit of before with writing for Make Sweenies from time to time and things of that nature. And then more recently, I've kind of veered off into poetry land doing a lot of different creative writing things in that area as well. But yeah, so I'm mostly known for the sad beige toys for sadbase children jokes.
Doree Shafrir (12:59):
It was so funny to me personally because I think my son was around two when you started the whole sad beige series. As a new mom, I had been influenced to want to do the whole neutrals and wooden toys and all the things, like seeing these influencers. And my son just gravitated to the brightly colored toys, the primary colors. When he started picking out his clothes, he wanted bright colors. He didn't want anything muted. He didn't want anything brown. I definitely felt like that aesthetic was so dominant. I don't know. I'm sort of out of baby world now, so I don't know if that is still kind of the dominant aesthetic. Do you have a sense of whether people are still obsessed with this look?
Hayley DeRoche (13:54):
I think overall, it's definitely still trending. I do think that it's kind of bumped down a little bit from, I think, the more upper class sensibility that it originally was sort of projecting. It's very much tied to Montessori and Waldorf and homeschooling and crunchy granola. So you have a lot of these different kind of subcultures connecting over this one aesthetic. If you're an influencer and you're trying to sell products, then it
Elise Hu (14:24):
Makes
Hayley DeRoche (14:24):
A lot of sense to have a beige backdrop. So you're beige house for a lot of people. And that definitely extends to baby stuff as well, as much as anything, I think.
Doree Shafrir (14:34):
All of this is intended to sell products. Yes. And we all just exist in this late stage capitalism where everything, whether it's aesthetic or not, it's just intended to get us to buy more stuff. Yes. And I'd just love to hear your thoughts on all of that and how it sort of works.
Hayley DeRoche (15:01):
So I think a lot of it comes down to the algorithm in a sense, kind of pegging you as a mark. So as soon as the internet figures out that you're expecting a baby, you are a target. You're going to get every email under the sun. It's going to follow you from website to website. It's going to figure out what you're looking for, what stroller caught your eye,
Elise Hu (15:22):
And
Hayley DeRoche (15:22):
Then it's going to haunt you for six to seven years. But that's the milieu, I guess, that we're all sort of parenting in where you can't just parent your child. You can't just make a decision. Now, as soon as you even talk about it in a room where your phone might've been, now the internet is going to start pestering you like, "Oh, you were talking about
Elise Hu (15:44):
This
Hayley DeRoche (15:44):
Type of parenting, or you were interested in Montessori and you were talking about mushrooms." It's very, very difficult to parent outside of this tornado of information trying to influence you. And some of it's welcome. I mean, everybody wants to figure out parenting advice for the problem that's bugging them. And if that information gets fed to you, that's great. But I do think that it just becomes very difficult to parent authentically if you don't exactly know who you are as a parent yet, and then you're just suddenly bombarded with everything telling you, "If you don't buy this, you're not a good parent. If you don't buy that, you're not a good parent. Send your child to this preschool." I think as more and more people find that a lot of those things are just out of reach, especially financially, I think it's really easy to feel bad about yourself, that you're not as good as the people who can afford A, B, or C.
(16:40)
I mean, even if it's just going to Disney or something, all of those boxes are things that I'm supposed to buy. And I don't think that that's what determines my worth as a parent or the type of parenting that I'm doing. And I think there's so much more to it than just an aesthetic that's following people around. I think it's this feeling of guilt that's following people around, kind of underlying that.
Doree Shafrir (17:01):
Yeah. And I feel like you do a really good job of making it clear that it's almost like you're not judging people for their individual choice to buy a wooden ring stacker. I love one. Right. It's more like you're just highlighting that they are part of this bigger system that is outside of their control and how much we are influenced and pressured, to your point, to consume all of this stuff all of the time. Yes. And it's, I mean, when you really start to sort of pick it apart, it is quite grim.
Hayley DeRoche (17:44):
But
Doree Shafrir (17:46):
Let's get to your book, which is called the Sadbage Parent Handbook. How did this come about and what do you kind of hope people take away from it?
Hayley DeRoche (17:57):
This first came about a publisher, craftsman part of Norton reached out to me about doing a book based on Sadbish, which was very exciting for me having done this for several years now, starting in 2021, which feels like a lifetime ago now.
(18:13)
So it was very exciting to have that opportunity. And then as far as what I want people to take away from it, I think I really want people to fall in love with who they can be as a parent, disconnected from marketing and toys and all of the stuff. Figure out who you are as a parent and also figure out and love who your kid really is without all of the stuff in the way. Because that's been one of the joys for me as a parent, is figuring out who my kids are as fully themselves. You are in a sense your child's influencer, the biggest one. But as much as I think we like to think that we have control because of that, we really don't. Your kids get to a point, mine are nine and 11 now, where they are making those choices for themselves.
(19:02)
And it's so fun to just watch them blossom and be themselves without that power that I used to have, if that makes sense. Relinquishing that power has been really joyful for me. And the other part of it for me is really falling in love with other parents.
(19:20)
And that's kind of part of the book. I start the book off with a kind of a winky dedication of like, this book is for moms. Well, some of you anyway. But by the end, my hope is that people also feel a lot of love and empathy for other parents out there because one of the biggest things for me as a parent has also been the mom group that I'm a part of. And it's been just like ... I mean, I love my kids, but my mom group is one of the big loves of my life and it's lovely and beautiful. And how lucky that you get to meet these people because of a specific life phase that you're in. I mean, it's almost like meeting a roommate in college or something, and that just becomes this huge part of your life through happenstance.
Doree Shafrir (20:04):
Yeah. I love that you're saying that because I do feel like there's a tendency, especially on social media, especially in comedy about parenting, is to highlight how tough it is or how annoying your kids are. And we get away from some of the joy of parenting and the joy of meeting other parents and being a parent to a child who is turning into a person. So it's cool to hear you highlight that. You also have been talking on TikTok about the analog life, and it seems to me that this is sort of all connected, right? How the focus on aesthetics and performing for social media removes us from the actual human connection of it all, whether it is the mom group or if you're not a parent, just other people. And I'd love to just hear you talk a little bit about what we lose when our lives are continually mediated by social media or AI.
(21:17)
Yeah.
Hayley DeRoche (21:18):
I mean, especially with the AI stuff, I think it was Sam Altman who was like, "I don't know how you can raise a baby without AI." And it's just like, "What are you talking about? " I mean, people have been raising babies since babies were invented and granted the internet certainly has made that easier in a lot of respects. I mean, you can find answers for anything. Now, whether AI is helping or hindering that is another question because of course now you don't know if the answers you're getting are really real and right. So shout out to libraries. I'm a librarian too, so you should ask your librarian for help. But also just this idea that we need these electronic tools or these algorithms or any of that to do what I think we know deep down inside we need to do. I mean, there's always going to be parenting advice and stuff we don't know that we need help with, but I don't need AI to write a lullaby for my kid.
(22:17)
I can do that. I don't want to just queue up some random recording or some random video and just be like, "Here, goodnight." There's this human element that's just so necessary. And I don't know that even calling it the analog life is doing it justice enough because it's just life.That's the most human thing is sitting in a rocker, rocking your child to sleep at three in the morning and they're just like a little heavy sack of bones and their cheek is hot, their breath is hot. It's just you two and that's it. And there's no ChatGPT that's ever going to replace that relationship. And I can't think of a single thing that I would want to ask chat when I'm doing that. And I can't imagine feeling the need to
(23:11)
Introduce this other random robot into that relationship. So for me, it's just like, I'm just offended, I guess, at the idea that I am not enough. And I don't mean that as like, everyone needs community, but I don't need a robot. I don't need this chat to gas me up about my decisions when it's not even real. It doesn't even know. It's nothing. It's ephemeral. I would much rather lean on my friends. And when we're tired and we can't answer, that's okay. And you just lift each other up and sometimes one person is carrying more than the others, and then the next time the other people are carrying, this is just the ebb and hoe relationship. So that's just, I know it's all so tangled up. But for me, when he said that, that was really kind of the key for me is like, "Oh, okay.
(24:03)
So you just want to take away the human element of one of the most human things you can do. " And I just say no to that.
Doree Shafrir (24:11):
Yeah. I mean, I think we need to say no to that collectively because otherwise the alternative seems very grim to me.
Hayley DeRoche (24:22):
Yeah. I don't want to watch my kids through a screen in the same way. I don't make content about my kids for the same reason. It's like I don't want to introduce this third party of whether it's like the internet and some sort of fake audience or ChatGPT. I don't know. There's something sacred that I want to try and keep where you can because I mean, the internet creeps into so much of our lives that that's pretty hard to do.
Doree Shafrir (24:47):
We will be right back. I want to also talk about another series that you have been doing for the past year and a half, I want to say.
Hayley DeRoche (25:04):
Yeah. Yeah. It's been going on for a while now.
Doree Shafrir (25:06):
Yeah. And it is the Drive to Target series.
Hayley DeRoche (25:12):
They're never going to carry my book now.
Doree Shafrir (25:16):
I want to play one of your recent videos just so people ... I feel like describing it doesn't quite do it justice. Yeah. I don't think
Hayley DeRoche (25:26):
It does. Yeah.
Doree Shafrir (25:27):
It's an experience. It's an experience.
Hayley DeRoche (25:29):
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(26:22)
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Doree Shafrir (26:36):
Okay. So we were kind of chatting before we started recording, and this is obviously not just about parenting, it's not just about sad beige, but it is about late stage capitalism and it is about consumerism. And it feels like all of your work is sort of of a piece. And so could you talk a little bit about this series and what it is and what are you trying to say here?
Hayley DeRoche (27:08):
It's a lot. So this style of poetry is called. And it's basically a way of detouring a known thing into kind of the antithesis of it. So there are some examples out there of like French art where they would take cigarette ads and turn them into the opposite or something like that. So it's like you take something and you turn it around and you flip it on itself to change the messaging. And what I'm doing is taking headlines and these viral trending topics, all of the things that the algorithm is just so hungry for, it will feed you that sun up to sundown. And I'm taking those and then kind of whittling them down or like through a funnel almost. So like if you think about the beginning of the poem as kind of the top of the funnel and then
Elise Hu (27:59):
Slowly it
Hayley DeRoche (28:00):
Kind of filters down into the final message, which is basically the news and reality that that algorithm is very effectively hiding. And it's also playing with those keywords precisely because that's how the algorithm works. So in this funny way to me, I'm using the tool of the algorithm against the algorithm,
(28:25)
Which is very juicy for me. So I love doing that. It's very satisfying from an artistic perspective in the same way that sometimes TikTok will throw up ads after it, which people always comment on. And I'm like, I don't add those, but I do consider them part of the work when that happens because it's just kind of like an exclamation point. It underlines it in a way. So each piece is a little bit different. I don't make that many of them. I'll make maybe one or two a month right now because it is ... I don't want to minimize what's happening, which is always something that you have to be careful about when you're making art about really serious stuff. And so there have been times when I've kind of broken character because my character is in a sense the algorithm, that perky TJ Maxx style of ad, ad, ad, ad, ad with my voice.
(29:17)
So there have been times when I've kind of broken character and just been like, there's no way to say this other than just what it is. But even then, it's like if you put that far enough into the video after all of the algorithmic bait essentially that I've put out, then people get to see that. And obviously it's also talking about censorship in a sense, TikTok changed ownership this January and people are definitely experiencing new things on that app. And I think it is scary that it is now very much controlled by our government and people in power who have a very specific plan for what they do and do You not want us to see on the internet.
(30:02)
And I think that that makes it a lot easier on such a global app like TikTok to remove that kind of globalization on it and just make it very, very US led. So every poem's a little bit different and sometimes it'll just be about what's speaking to me at that moment, what's really upsetting me at that moment. And it's kind of different every time, but I really enjoy writing them and it really does kind of twist my brain around in a certain way to do it. And I like to think I'm pretty good at it.
Doree Shafrir (30:35):
You are. You're really good at it. I mean, they're really good. And the eerie music in the background and your delivery is so good. I suggest all of you go and look at Hailey's TikTok, which is SadBaige, and she has a playlist called Drive to Target, and you can see all of them.
Hayley DeRoche (30:55):
The reason it's called Drive to Target, I should probably clarify, is because it's kind of the running theme. And for me, it just kind of stands in for distract yourself, drive to target, distract yourself. It's the same as you go to Starbucks, something like that. But drive to Target, particularly when we are in fact the target of censorship, we are the target of this government, it seems like. It hates its own people. You can say drive to target, but drive to target can also mean the opposite, which to me is kind of the whole piece.
Doree Shafrir (31:26):
Yes. It's so layered. And I also, I love what you say about kind of using the algorithm against itself.You can tell when some of your videos have broken containment.
Hayley DeRoche (31:39):
Unfortunately. I stopped checking the comments after a certain point. When it's a broken containment, you're like, okay, well, now we're just going to get Lord only knows.
Doree Shafrir (31:50):
Right, right. Which is just another sort of layer of all of this. Like, oh, I did a poem about Taylor Swift and now her actual fans have found this and don't know what the hell I'm talking about. Yes. So just your whole meta commentary on all of that, I just find so fascinating. And I think also they stand alone as their own poems and pieces of performance art. So what you're doing is so beautiful and so subversive. Thank you. Thank you.
Hayley DeRoche (32:24):
It's fun to talk about algogorithmic stuff because it is really just this ribbon that kind of runs from the book to this. And people who liked Sad Beige because of that will like Target. And they'll definitely like my book, whether they came to me for the poetry or The Sad Beige. I really feel like if you care about that stuff, then you will love this book because not a lot of other parenting books talk about that. And that's my favorite topic.
Doree Shafrir (32:49):
No,
Hayley DeRoche (32:49):
They
Doree Shafrir (32:49):
Don't. Yeah. So Hayley, I was thinking it might be fun to have you read a little bit from your book. Is there something that you would like to share with our listeners?
Hayley DeRoche (33:01):
So one of my personal favorite running themes, like running bits in this book is an advice column from Dear Abyss. So if you're familiar with Dear Abby, this is Dear Abyss. And it is basically an advice column from being untethered from space and chime. The abyss. Welcome to Dear Abyss, your advice lifeline for all the parenting questions you were too afraid to ask a mere mortal. What is your question, my child? Dear Abyss. I'm having my first child and I'm overwhelmed by everything I'm supposed to decide and the stakes feel so high. Montessori versus Waldorf, baby sign language versus telepathy, college versus trade school. It's all so much, yet if I choose wrong, it feels like I'll ruin everything. You're an all powerful, timeless entity existing outside the realm of space and time. And I thought you'd be just the right thing to ask for guidance.
(33:58)
So what's your number one piece of advice for new parents who want to give a child the very best start in life? Sincerely, expecting the best. Dear bestie. In life, there is no start just as there is no end. Think of life less like a race and more like an undulating ribbon, weaving a mysterious design out of the fibers of life. A new child is thus an old child and an old child, forever a new one. You too are thus both a new parent as fresh faced and dewy-eyed as your little one will be upon their arrival and as ancient as the hills. Given all this, the best way to give your child a good start in life is to continue as you are going, but double it. For just as your love is doubling with this new family member, your example of goodness can be multiplied as an example for them.
(34:46)
If you gift a dollar to someone in need next time, give them two. If you howl at the moon, howl twice as loud. And if you look up at the stars and ponder the inexplicable smallness of yourself in relation to the ever-expanding universe, ponder that smallness with double the awe and double the gasps as the falling stars pass before your eyes. See how the shooting stars have doubted. Oops. See how the shooting stars have doubled in your eyes and your babes wee eyes as well. Let the ribbon of time unfurl as it may. Let the stars fall. All will be well. Cheers, the abyss. And I just had so much fun writing these. Some are more silly than others, but it's so fun to write as a black hole. Also, the illustrations are very, very sweet.
Doree Shafrir (35:37):
And I'm by real humans. Yes. The illustrations are lovely. The book itself is lovely. It really looks like a gift book.
Hayley DeRoche (35:46):
Yes. It makes a wonderful gift.
Doree Shafrir (35:48):
Yes. Well, Hayley, you mentioned that you were doing some book events. Do you want to let our listeners
Hayley DeRoche (35:55):
Know we're
Doree Shafrir (35:55):
Going to be able to catch you in person?
Hayley DeRoche (35:57):
So we are having a book launch at Fountain Bookstore in Richmond, Virginia on April 21st. I will also be at the American Library Association Conference in Chicago, and there will be a bookstore event in Chicago that weekend as well. And then I'm doing a couple different events here in Virginia, as well as in New York, Maryland, Baltimore, and possibly Columbus, Ohio. And just a number of different places along the way, kind of on the Eastern Seaboard.
Doree Shafrir (36:31):
Very cool. And where can our listeners find your work on
Hayley DeRoche (36:37):
TikTok
Doree Shafrir (36:37):
And Instagram?
Hayley DeRoche (36:39):
So I am at Sadbeige on TikTok and I am at official Sadbeige on Instagram because someone else has SabBerge and they're not me. Rude. I know. Very rude. Very rude. And then I do have a Substack as well, which is weird but okay.
Doree Shafrir (36:58):
Well, thank you, Hailey. It was so great to get to talk to you. And the new book is the SadBaige Parent Handbook. Thank you again. Thank
Hayley DeRoche (37:08):
You.
Doree Shafrir (37:12):
It was really fun to get to talk to Hailey and her book is delightful. If you have a new parent in your life who would appreciate- Yeah, that'd be a good gift. ... send up of influencer parent culture. It's a really great gift. Totally.
Elise Hu (37:27):
All
Doree Shafrir (37:28):
Right. So now we are in the intention zone and my intention last week was to have a chill attitude at the Saturday match. And the Saturday match was a playoff match where I was playing against people who I knew would be much better than I am. Oh,
Elise Hu (37:44):
Right. I remember you set this up.
Doree Shafrir (37:47):
Yes. So I had found a video, and actually we'll link to it in the show notes by this tennis coach, Jonathan Stoke, who also has a podcast, and he does a lot of YouTube videos. And he had a video on how to play as an underdog. And I watched it and I was like, "Oh, this is so helpful." It just sort of helped me kind of reset my brain about the match
(38:16)
And I just went into it. I feel like I went into it with a really good attitude and so did my partner. I sent it to her as well and she was like, "Oh, this was great. Thank you. " And the score was not great, but I felt like we stayed at every point. We got to a lot of deuces. They were better. They were just better. So they were able to win all those Deuce games and they just were able to close, but I didn't feel like, "Oh by God, they are so ... " Overpowering, right? So overpowering us. I think they actually did seem a little surprised at how competitive it felt. One of them was like, "Oh, it felt a lot closer than the score reflects," which I think was accurate. Good for y'all. Yeah, thank you. That was super fun. Yeah, you should be proud.
(39:08)
Thank you. Thank you so much. And then this week I am going to continue the great office decluttering because it's going well and I'm just going to continue the momentum. And also, I was talking about this on the casual chat, but I took a page out of Elisa's book and I've just been selling so much, just things that I never would have necessarily tried to sell before.
Elise Hu (39:34):
I couldn't believe that I sold a random crystal block cell phone stand for $15. Why would somebody want that?
Doree Shafrir (39:45):
Yeah. And I do like to give stuff away on buy nothing because it's easy, but in this particular scenario, I was like, "Let me just see what I can sell before I just give it away." And then it turned out a lot. So that was great. How about you? Did you get a massage?
Elise Hu (40:03):
I didn't. I didn't. I still have these two spa certificates I need to use and we have spring break coming up, so I don't know if I'm going to get to because the kids are going to be around, but I do want to ... So my intention is going to be to try something new with the kids. So I don't know if that means if we stay in town, maybe taking a surf lesson because I've never taken a surf lesson even though we live right by the ocean and Ava's learned to surf, but my younger ones haven't. So maybe I'm just going to say try something new as my
Doree Shafrir (40:35):
Intention. I love it. I love
Elise Hu (40:36):
It. Who knows what it's
Doree Shafrir (40:37):
Going to be? Ironically, I learned to surf when I lived in New York on Rockaway Beach and then took a surf vacation. I loved it. And then since moving to LA, I have not surfed.
Elise Hu (40:49):
Oh my gosh.
Doree Shafrir (40:50):
I know. I think Henry would really like it. So maybe down the road we will get back into it. All right. Thanks everyone. Forever35 is hosted and produced by me, Doree Shafrir and Elise Hu, and produced and edited by Samee Junio. Sami Reed is our project manager and our network partner is Acast. Thanks everyone.
Elise Hu (41:10):
Talk to you next time.
Doree Shafrir (41:11):
Bye.